Some people’s kids

"HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles" (hondasfordsvolvo)
10/17/2019 at 13:47 • Filed to: None

I just saw a truck with this on the back window. Like a full rear window deal, not a little sticker. It amazes me that some one could miss the irony of having the images of two opposing ideologies mixed together.

He also had several anti Hillary bumper stickers. I and say 15 political bumper stickers all together. He’s probably a very nice man.

DISCUSSION (55)

The Ghost of Oppo > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 13:57

Kinja'd!!!

Aremmes > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 13:58

Mental illness takes many forms. Few seldom present themselves so readily.

Danimalk - Drives a Slow Car Fast > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 13:59

For some reason this song from a musical genius was the first thing to pop in my head :

BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 13:59

I can almost guarantee he’d tell me to “ go back to Mexico” .

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 14:06

This flag has every reason to be shown in a historical context. I hate that it has been adopted to represent the ideology of bigotry and racism. Can’t those losers just make their own racist flag and fly that so that the CSA and battle flags can rest in historical peace, and make it easier for the rest of us to pick out the racists?

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever
10/17/2019 at 14:10

I mean based on context that’s basically what it does. A t a museum/historical site ? Okay. Not at a museum? Racist

VajazzleMcDildertits - read carefully, respond politely > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 14:16

I have a few mixed feelings about the flag. I liked the Dukes of Hazzard TV show, mostly for the General Lee since I was too young to understand what else was going on, really. I was a very young kid while it was on air. So I always have this temptation to wrap anything I own as a General Lee regardless of how tacky or tone-deaf it is .

If the flag didn’t have any connotations I probably would. I get the history, I get what it’s supposed to mean , and I’m not going to try and revise what happened or argue about what we’re supposed to do with it.

I love Southern Food and Southern BBQ, I don’t visit a lot but I’ve met a lot of expat Southerners that were nice folks. I want communal policies that benefit and represent all states well. But I’m not going to sit here and delude myself that the ideology behind the flag represents anything but something from the past we shouldn’t propagate.

Captain of the Enterprise > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 14:19

I’m just going to leave this here.

Chariotoflove > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 14:22

I’ve been living in the South for a number of years now. What I see is that the Confederate flag doesn’t mean what it originally meant for many of the good ole boys that fly it. It doesn’t mean they want the US to go away (most are staunch patriots), and it doesn’t stand for racism in their minds. It seems to have been co-opted as a symbol of regional pride, riffing on the old meme of southerners vs. yankees, a la The Dukes of Hazard.

I would have picked a different symbol without so much historical and ideological baggage, but there you go.

Captain of the Enterprise > Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever
10/17/2019 at 14:22

For Sweden > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 14:23

Never forget the Confederates tried to ally with the Brits lmao

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 14:23

Hey, but it’s UV sealed, and chemical and scratch resistant! Maybe he just got a super good deal on the sticker!

But given by all the other stickers you mentioned...yeah, doesn’t sound like the driver is a particularly happy person to be around.

ranwhenparked > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 14:27

Isnt this like if someone in Germany were to combine a swastika flag and the old imperial flag in one? It doesn’t really work, you can’t be loyal to the United States and support the old Confederate at the same time.

That said, there was a period ca. mid 70s-early/mid 80s when the Confederate flag was put on all sorts of mass consumer products and souvenirs in an effort to position it as a generic symbol of unspecified rebellion against nothing in particular, sort of the same reason kids get nose rings and wear JNCOs. Someone who lived through that might lack the contextual awareness to understand how nonsensical their usage of it is.

ranwhenparked > VajazzleMcDildertits - read carefully, respond politely
10/17/2019 at 14:29

The South is a distinct cultural region with a strong regional identity, so I get the desire to have some sort of regional symbol, but maybe everyone needs to come up with a new flag design with a clean break from past negative connotations, and all agree to use that instead. Like when South Africa changed theirs after Apartheid.

MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick) > Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever
10/17/2019 at 14:35

http://www.usflag.org/confederate.stars.and.bars.html

Unless the historical context is battle or being in the navy, it’s not even the right flag, which is indicative of the fact it is not being used in a historical sense, but in the modern interpretation.

MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick) > VajazzleMcDildertits - read carefully, respond politely
10/17/2019 at 14:38

If someone wants to show their pride for the south, why would they choose to display a symbol of that particular point in history, which is also a moment of great loss of life and autonomy? Especially when the flag means what it does now, was only one of many flags the confederacy flew, and there are state flags for whatever your actual regional heritage is (Texans wouldn’t want you to assume they’re from Missouri I would think).

MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick) > ranwhenparked
10/17/2019 at 14:38

JNCOs!!!!!!!!

VajazzleMcDildertits - read carefully, respond politely > MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick)
10/17/2019 at 14:41

Sometimes I hypothesize that they just couldn’t think up a different design that they could agree on in the last century. Also, history is probably forgotten or disregarded a lot easier than we think by any community at large, so the details of what could be used/proposed is probably lost to the majority.

And all the Texans I’ve met never want to be identified as from anywhere else, for better or worse.

OPPOsaurus WRX > The Ghost of Oppo
10/17/2019 at 14:45

but isn;t that the French flag?

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > Captain of the Enterprise
10/17/2019 at 14:50

That made the last half out of my job much more enjoyable.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > For Sweden
10/17/2019 at 15:01

Wow

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo
10/17/2019 at 15:01

Wouldn’t surprise me

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > For Sweden
10/17/2019 at 15:03

Not too mention being pro- smuggling through Mexico

gmporschenut also a fan of hondas > MKULTRA1982(ConCrustyBrick)
10/17/2019 at 15:12

Because for many after, they don’t look back at that era as a bad thing.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > Chariotoflove
10/17/2019 at 15:26

Agreed. In the DC region, most of my encounters have been with people who like to display it to “trigger snowflakes” and “own the libs. ” Because apparently we’re all 13 and edgy now.

Chariotoflove > Snuze: Needs another Swede
10/17/2019 at 15:28

Yeah, I mean, there are better things to get your dander up about and rally about than this flag.

MrSnrub > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 15:51

But m uh race-based slavery heritage!!

nerd_racing > Captain of the Enterprise
10/17/2019 at 15:55

The part about re-arranging Agnew’s name to grow a penis slayed me.

Captain of the Enterprise > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 16:00

Glad to help!

Captain of the Enterprise > nerd_racing
10/17/2019 at 16:01

Yeah lol

The Ghost of Oppo > OPPOsaurus WRX
10/17/2019 at 16:01

Why not both?

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s
10/17/2019 at 16:03

Eh, most of my family is of southern descent, hence I have a Confederate flag tattoo on my shoulder. It’s not there for racism, it’s there in support of the family members lost in the war, sadly too many people automatically jump to the “racist” boat and start judging.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > Snuze: Needs another Swede
10/17/2019 at 16:06

More so they know they have nothing left in their miserable lives and owning up to their failures would mean admitting they are wrong, and therefore weak and not worthy of their perceived superiority. Also getting to play victim can be incredibly lucrative and also self-fulfilling ideologically.

TheBloody, Oppositelock lives on in our shitposts. > Chariotoflove
10/17/2019 at 16:06

Even that shows some level of tone deafness on their part, I mean do you think they ever once stopped to think about maybe one of their neighbors had Grand Parents (or great grandparents) that were slaves?

MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s > Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness
10/17/2019 at 16:06

That may have been why you got it, but can you really argue it hasn’t become the rally flag of choice for racists?

Chariotoflove > TheBloody, Oppositelock lives on in our shitposts.
10/17/2019 at 16:12

Doubtful. Like I said, I don’t think it’s a good idea. There are better ways IMO to show your pride in your home culture. That’s just what I observe. But I also don’t get triggered over it.

Galileo Humpkins (aka MC Clap Yo Handz) > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 16:18

Cue the, “That’s not what it’s about, bro. It’s about our history, honoring our past, bro.” Nonsense. There’s a lot I like(d) about being born/raised in the south, but sweet holy hell there is so much more that I dislike/hate.

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > MasterMario - Keeper of the V8s
10/17/2019 at 16:20

Oh I’m not arguing it hasn’t, just that it’s wrong to automatically assume.

I mean by assuming someone is a racist/bigot because they have a confederate flag makes the person assuming a bigot as well.

CobraJoe > Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness
10/17/2019 at 16:25

Eh, most of my fa mily is of southern descent, hence I have a Confederate flag tattoo on my shoulder. It’s not there for racism, it’s there in support of the family members lost in the war, sadly too many people automatically jump to the “racist” boat and start judging.

The meaning of symbols change over time, and in the confederate flag’s case, it came to symbolize the part of the country that fought to own people as property - even if that doesn’t fully encapsulate the history .

Even though you chose the symbol to represent something different in your life, it’s downright impossible for strangers to know that your personal reasons for getting that symbol do not align with the common perception of it.

Sorry man, but this is something that you’ll have to live with as long as you display that tattoo. But that’s also 98% of the reason why I haven’t gotten a tattoo for myself yet, I’m afraid of the change in perception of whatever I get inked on my skin.

Snuze: Needs another Swede > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/17/2019 at 16:28

There are a lot of sad, dumb reasons to display the Confederate battle flag, and while most people jump to racism, self-loathing is another prime candidate.

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > CobraJoe
10/17/2019 at 16:30

Likewise, those calling me a bigot/racist because of my tattoo are themselves bigots.

I generally choose to ignore anything that comes of it, if you have a problem with me being proud of my family’s history, so be it.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > Chariotoflove
10/17/2019 at 16:31

I see this flag a whole lot out here in the PNW as well. If I were to be generous I really don’t know what message they’re trying to convey. Either they’re lost, or are signing up for the meaning the symbol has taken on. These stickers are 90% of the time accompanied by other messages you’d entirely expect to be sported by someone showing such a symbol based on current stereotypes.

Chariotoflove > ZHP Sparky, the 5th
10/17/2019 at 16:40

Maybe transplants who feel out of their element and are grasping for something of their southern home?

I don’t know, that’s all I got.

Kanaric > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 16:49

Anyone with this on their car doesn’t know shit about history or doesn’t think at all the flag means what the rest of the country thinks.

Textured Soy Protein > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 17:04

Translation:

I LIKE MURRICA.

ALSO, FUCK EVERYONE WHO’S NOT WHITE, RURAL AND BIGOTED.

2Fast2Furious: Rotary Powered > BlueMazda2 - Blesses the rains down in Africa, Purveyor of BMW Individual Arctic Metallic, Merci Twingo
10/17/2019 at 17:20

Go back to mexica you spainyard!

CobraJoe > Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness
10/17/2019 at 17:32

I generally choose to ignore anything that comes of it, if you have a problem with me being proud of my family’s history, so be it .

You can be proud of your family, and yet not approve of everything they did. The fact that some of them fought in the civil war as Confederate soldiers does not fully define who they were or who you are now. J ust like the fact that my grandpa directly caused the death of my grandma before I was born does not fully define him or the rest of my family. I’m proud that he fought in WWII, but I’m sure as hell try to keep a close eye on my emotions when I start getting angry.

Likewise, those calling me a bigot/racist because of my tattoo are themselves bigots.

Just for a second, consider what the other person could be thinking. A flag known for representing the part of the country who fought to own human beings with a different skin color is still commonly shown off by people who still believe that there is a “superior race”.

It isn’t that far of a reach to think that s omeone who is willing to have that flag tattooed on their skin and is proudly showing it off might be doing so to advertise their beliefs. After all, it’s common to get religious symbols and mantras tatt ooed in visible places.

And even after learning that you got the flag to remember your family’s history, it still can appear that you value the fact that your family fought for the confederate ideals (including slavery) more than anything else.

I’m not trying to lecture you or say that “you dun goofed” when you got that tattoo, I’m just trying to point out that people who have a strong, negative reaction to your tattoo probably have a completely different understanding of that symbol .

cmill189 - sans Volvo > ZHP Sparky, the 5th
10/17/2019 at 17:56

Oregon has a rich history with racism and white nationalism. They aren't lost.

nermal > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 17:59

The meaning of both flags has changed over time. At the present, there is a wide disparity between the intent of those displaying them, and the perceived intent .

Arguably the primary principle that the USA was founded on was armed rebellion against the government. The Confede rac y was also.... an armed rebellion against the government. In that regard the two are very similar.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > cmill189 - sans Volvo
10/17/2019 at 18:03

Oh I know. Which is why the claim of “it’s not racist!” is disingenuous.

ranwhenparked > gmporschenut also a fan of hondas
10/17/2019 at 20:02

And siding with the Emperor Maximiliano after the war , in opposition to US foreign policy.

subexpression > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/17/2019 at 20:35

I don’t particularly take the Confederate battle/naval flag to mean anything by itself . I’ve spent a lot of time in areas that were near the border during the Civil War, the kind of places where you had a lot of families with men fighting on both sides. There are both Union and Confederate monuments in the area. I don’t have to drive that far to start seeing both flags hanging on front porches .

I do, however, recognize that it has a different meaning to other people, so it’s not something I’d wave around (not that I’m southern in any way ) . Unfortunately, people rarely offer me the same courtesy about symbols that I’ve seen strongly associated with racism and xenophobia . I guess it’s only bigotry when the other guy says it.

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > Snuze: Needs another Swede
10/17/2019 at 22:33

History is not their strong suit. But then again, do these people even have a “strong suit” besides scapegoating?

Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness > CobraJoe
10/18/2019 at 06:55

Just for a second, consider what the other person could be thinking.

This is a 2 way street. The lack of doing this is why this country is the way it is today.

Also, FYI, the North owned slaves and continued owning slaves after slavery was “abolished”, no one seems to take issue with that fact though. The main premise of the war was NOT slavery, it was the South fighting against over-reaching government, the very reason we left Europe in the first place. Strangely enough, that part of the history of the Civil war seems to be left out these days. The reason it is seen as a “racist/bigot” symbol is because people are ignorant to the facts of the Civil war.

CobraJoe > Long_Voyager, Now With More Caravanny Goodness
10/18/2019 at 10:41

Sure, the south was fighting for their individual state’s rights against an overreaching federal government. But, one of the rights they were fighting for was slavery.

The point is, if part of the fight is for the right to own other humans as property, it’s kind of hard to acknowledge the other things they were fighting for. Just like it’s hard to claim that a restaurant serves good food when there’s a turd in the soup.

The reason the confederate flag is seen as a “racist/bigot” symbol is not necessarily because people are ignorant of the facts of the civil war, it’s because they view the “Fighting for slavery” as a fact that pollutes any other motive.

And I think that “The north had slaves too” would not be an effective method to get people to change their views of the confederate flag.

Just for a second, consider what the other person could be thinking.

This is a 2 way street. The lack of doing this is why this country is the way it is today.

I can agree to that.

Though you might be in the odd situation where explaining your reasoning might not help. For someone who can only see the slavery aspect in the civil war, t aking pride in your family fighting in the civil war is pretty difficult to separate from taking pride in the confederate ideals.

Again, I’m not trying to convince you that you’re wrong, just remind you that the meaning of symbols change over time and that others might see things differently. Personally, the confederate flag means nothing to me, I’m not even sure my ancestors were in America yet, and my state didn’t exist until after the civil war ended.